Sulforaphane

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N2531
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by N2531 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 12:54 pm

The frozen broccoli is still packed with the precursor—remember that’s heat resistant—and we could get lots of sulforaphane out of the frozen broccoli by adding some outside enzyme. Where do we get myrosinase enzyme from? Researchers just buy theirs from a chemical company. But we can just walk into any grocery store.

All cruciferous vegetables have this myrosinase. Mustard greens, a cruciferous vegetable, grow out of little mustard seeds, which we can buy ground up in the spice aisle as mustard powder. If we sprinkled some mustard powder on our cooked frozen broccoli, would it start churning out sulforaphane? We didn’t know…until now.

Boiling broccoli prevents the formation of any significant levels of sulforaphane due to inactivation of the enzyme. However, researchers from the University of Reading found that the addition of powdered mustard seeds to the heat processed broccoli significantly increased the formation of sulforaphane. In the video I mentioned earlier, Second Strategy to Cooking Broccoli, you can see the amount of sulforaphane in boiled broccoli versus the amount after half a teaspoon or a teaspoon of mustard powder is added. Both a half teaspoon and a full teaspoon increase sulforaphane by the same amount, suggesting that we could use even use less mustard powder for the same effect. Therefore, although domestic cooking leads to the deactivation of myrosinase and stops sulforaphane formation, the addition of powdered mustard seeds to cooked cabbage-family vegetables provides a natural source of the enzyme such that it’s practically like eating them raw.

So, if we forget to chop our greens in the morning for the day, or are using frozen, we can just sprinkle some mustard powder on top at the dinner table and we’re all set. Daikon radish, horseradish, or wasabi—all cruciferous vegetables packed with the enzyme—work as well.

http://nutritionfacts.org/2016/02/09/ho ... -broccoli/
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Thu Mar 09, 2017 11:29 pm

N2531,

Great information. I will show the photos of my process including mustard seed (and the supplier, as I contacted to confirm the type...with links).

Sorry I have not posted the photos yet, but I had my first batch of sprouts fail and I got off schedule. In about two days I'll have sprouts in all three stages and I can show the process.
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by N2531 » Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:44 pm

I have been eating broccoli and Brussels sprouts. With mustard powder. Its only been a week so there won't be any progress.
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:58 am

Hello,

Here are the photos of the process, as promised.

It was too difficult to load 16 very large images on to this site, so I have linked it to an album at my Flickr page. Just click the link. There is some text for each photo. Let me know if you have any questions.

It's not been 90 days yet, but I'll give a brief update. My lipomas are smaller and much, much denser. It's as if they have compacted into hard little marbles. The large one on the left, where I have very, very few, was difficult to find. But, there are still tons of them on my right side. They are smaller, more mobile, and much, much harder. I doubt they will actually go away. They seem to have reached a compacted state.

Two things for certain. They are not bigger. And the one painful one has not hurt in months. I only have one single lipoma that ever really hurt, and that has completely stopped.

Is the variable sulforaphane? This I do not know and cannot make any claim it is the significant variable. Sulforaphane is the ONLY new variable I've introduced, so at least that is a small positive.

I will continue to force feed myself the sprouts 2-3 times a week. That is all I can stomach at this point. They are not easy to eat.

Also, go back and watch the short 3 minute video I posted in the opening post on this thread for the science on why we cook the sprouts at 158F for 10 minutes.

Link to Flickr

https://www.flickr.com/photos/56654016@ ... 8995295232
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by N2531 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:50 am

Do you have before and after pictures of your lipomas?
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:18 pm

Before and after pictures.

No, I've never taken pictures. But as I said in my opening post, I have many, but they are smaller than most and many were matted. There are two on my abdomen that could be photographed, as they were in an area of very little fat and protruded.

As I said in my original post, I do not want to hype this as a cure all for everyone. And I'm not even certain it is the actual driver of my improvement.

I do know, with very, very high confidence, that after years of my lipomas being a matted mess, that now they are smaller, more dense, and far more mobile.

I am also on a Ketogenic diet, and I don't play at it. It is very strict and I average beta hydroxybutyrate blood levels between .7 and 2.2. That said, a year on Keto didn't do anything for my lipomas.

I plan to continue with the sulforaphane for another 3 months. Then I might stop and see if my lipomas worsen. I'm really into medical tests and I do this for on/off testing for anything I've ever tried that I believe works. Of course the other health issues I've targeted for improvement can be measured with precise blood work. This lipoma problem will always have a subjective element that will make it difficult to make any truly valid claims.

Good Luck
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:26 pm

hey matt1007, thanks a lot for the pics. If I understand correctly, you put those seeds in the jar, heat the water to 158F, and then pour that water in a jar where the seeds are and let it sit for 10 minutes. Then you drain the water and add yellow mustard seeds (which you grind before adding?).
What then? do you have to eat that mass or can you blend it into a liquid? (maybe mix with lemon water or something)
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matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:34 am

251152,

That is basically correct.

Not sure what you mean about seeds. It is the sprouts that we cook in the water.

I grow the seeds in the same jar I cook them in, after the 5-7 days it takes to grow the sprouts.

1. Seeds soak for 12 hours (longer and the germination rate seems to decrease).

2. Drain water and invert the jar, so it can always be draining, but still get some air. There is a screen in place of the metal jar lid.

3. After 50% or so sprout, move them from the dark/shade to sunlight. I put mine on a windowsill.

4. Let grow in sunlight for 1-3 days, until the first leaves are fully formed.

5. Rinse the seeds and sprouts at least once a day and drain water.

Cooking

1. Per the video, we can significantly increase the sulforaphane by heating to 158F for ten minutes. I do this with water at 175F, which averages out to around 158F when mixed with the sprouts.

2. I add 1 gram of ground mustard seeds per 100 grams of sprouts. This is not required, but it will certainly increase the potential yield of active sulforaphane.

And the hard part, which is eating them. You need to chew it and get the hot/fire taste. Like bitter radishes. This is the reaction of the two primary chemicals creating sulforaphane.

And it is not easy. I'm down to two 160 gram doses per week. Eating the entire 160 grams is not fun.

Good Luck
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:09 am

I guess the hardest part for me now is to get these broccoli sprouting seeds and yellow mustard seeds somewhere... I'll ask around, thanks matt!
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matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:22 pm

Well, no further reduction in lipoma size. I wonder if the hard, "marbles" are like a form of scar tissue. I don't know. I will continue for another 90 days, but I'm not optimistic that there will be any more reduction.

I did get back full blood-work today, and it was a very comprehensive panel, including ion mobility. Across the board, every single value has stayed the same or improved in the approximately 90 days I've been taking high doses of sulforaphane. One in particular is amazing, and that is my ldl particle count. It is down to an amazing 1344. My previous best value ever was 1734. This, and this alone, is justification to continue with the treated sprouts. I'll retest in 90 days and then go off the sulforaphane for 90 days and test again (it costs a few hundred bucks to do all the tests, so I don't like to do them more than once a quarter). If my numbers turn bad, or the lipomas increase to their previous size, I'll adopt the sulforaphane for life. Should be able to make that call in Sept sometime.
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:29 pm

Hey matt, a question:
I found broccoli seeds on an online shop that delivers them here, but it doesn't say anything about sprouting, it's just "broccoli seeds". Is Broccoli Seeds and Broccoli Sprouting Seeds the same thing?

And another thing - at this point I don't really believe there's anything out there that can shrink them (aside from non sustainable water fasting) but I think we may at least be able to stop the growth and appearance of new ones. How are you doing on that front? Have you seen any new lipomas or current ones growing since you started the Sulforaphane treatment?
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matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:58 pm

Hello 251152,

The very first picture in my photo series has the address of the seeds I use. These seeds are supposed to be high in sulforaphane, but from what I've read, all broccoli seeds are high in sulforaphane. So, I don't know how meaningful, or valid, that statement is. That said, Todd's Seeds seems to be highly regarded and very customer focused. I got my seeds fast. And the germination rate has been pretty good (I'd guess over 80%).

Just don't let your seeds soak for more than 12 hours, as I've found this reduces the germination rate a bit.

Here is a direct link. I bought the 2.5 pound bag, but that is not currently listed (don't know why).

http://seeds.toddsseeds.com/calabrese-b ... ing-seeds/

As for my lipomas shrinking, as I've said, I don't want to overhype sulforaphane. My lipomas are smaller. Sure, everything is subjective and I can't measure them myself. But they are smaller. And some (like on my left side) are much smaller. The biggest one (on my right side and in what used to be a matted cluster) is still very, very easy to find. But, it has changed. It is much harder and smaller, and has a hard edge on one side.

Again, there is no doubt that something changed my lipomas in the past few months. I believe it is sulforaphane, as that is the only variable I've changed (that I'm aware of at least).

I certainly do not have any new lipomas, but I honestly was not getting that many news one before I started sulforaphane, so in my case that may not be a very meaningful statement.

Even though I'm maybe 3-4 pounds lighter, the two lipomas that could be seen on my stomach are not visible. I can find one of them, but the other can't be found unless I've eaten a very large meal.

The most significant thing for me is the matted mess of lipomas on my right side is no longer a matted mess. I can feel individual lipomas and they are highly mobile.

As I said about a week or two ago, there has been no additional improvement, as it appears they have reduced to a given size and will go no smaller. In 3 months I'll give another update and then I'll probably stop sulforaphane for a period of time (3 or 6 months) and see if my lipomas worsen. This is the only valid method I know to isolate if sulforphane was the true variable and/or was/is actually effective.

Good Luck
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:20 am

Todd's doesn't deliver to Eastern Europe.
How much seeds (in grams) do you use per batch? Just so I know how much to order so it lasts me a while. I'm thinking to test it for at least 2 month, do you think this is a reasonable time to see if it has any progress?
I didn't doubt your lipomas shrank to a degree, in fact some other members mentioned this with other treatments several times, they just always stop at some point as is the case with yours I guess (unfortunately).
At this point, I'd be happy if I can just stop the progress of this condition as I'm getting new ones at a pretty high rate. I can then just cut out the existing ones, I'll take scars over these lumps any day.

so to summarize:
- Do you think 2 months test is reasonable?
- How much should I order so it lasts me that long?
- What's the dose one should take and the frequency?

Thank you for the advice and guidance : )
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matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 3:57 pm

Hello 251152,

First, I'm not an expert in any of this. I've just watched some videos and read many, many papers on sulforaphane and then just, "made up" my own treatment plan.

I use 2 tablespoons of seeds per jar. Each jar, after 5-7 days of growing (with my lower level of Michigan sunlight in the winter) is yielding between 120 and 180 grams of sprouts.

I'm trying to eat 160 grams twice a week, but lately I've been averaging more like 100 grams. They are difficult to eat and with the added ground mustard seeds, not very tasty. But I do it because I believe it has worked for me.

I noticed a change before six weeks. Or I should say that at the six week point I became confident that something was happening.

If you have watched the long 2 and a half hour interview ith Jed Fehey, you will have learned a great deal about how sulforaphane works from one of the true leaders in the field. Johns Hopkins personnel pioneered work with sulforaphane and they continue to advance the work with people like Fehey I mention this again, as I think there is a big clue as to how to think about the usage of sulforaphane and perhaps things like activation of the nrf2 pathway. Fehey say something like, "if all you ate was sulforaphane, you would have real problems". What he is getting at is sulforaphane is triggering a response in the body that might be from an antagonist...which in this case is the compound sulforaphane, which Jed also explains is like a pesticide to small bugs.

With that thinking, 2 or maybe 3 treatments a week is enough to get the response. The body is going to clear the sulforaphane quickly, but the cascade of the bodies protective response is going to last several days. Jed talks about this in the video too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0lBVCpq8jc&t=7394s

The truth is, I'm just guessing all of this based on the available information. I could be wrong about all of this.

Good Luck
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:33 am

yeah I know, you don't have to explain that you're no expert. No on is on this forum pretty much, we're all fumbling in the dark, trying to find some solution to this problem of ours; so I take all of this with grain of salt : )

When you say you're trying to eat 160 grams twice a week, do you mean that you eat 320 in total per week, or that you eat 80 grams twice per week?
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:50 pm

Hello,

I try to eat 160 grams twice a week, for a weekly total of 320 grams. But, lately I've not been able to eat that much, so I'm eating 100 grams twice a week for 200 total.
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 1:50 pm

I watched the 2:30 hour video and did some searching online but still couldn't figure out if it is fine to grind these seeds as is and just take that smoothie instead of going through the process of sprouting.
Do you happen to have some info on that matt1007?
Also, how are your lipomas?
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matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 3:05 pm

Hello 251152,

I have the same information that you do regarding seeds. Fehey claims the seeds are extremely high in sulforaphane, but they taste terrible. I would guess if you could stomach a large dose of them ground up, it might be effective, but that is just a guess.

My lipomas are absolutely unchanged. The initial reduction in the first six weeks or so has remained fairly constant. I still have the hard and marble like structures under the skin. I cannot make any claim they have gotten smaller. But, I'm not displeased, as I previously mentioned before sulforaphane, they were larger, more visible, and most certainly not getting smaller.

I plan to finish out the six months of self-testing, then stop all sulforaphane for maybe 90 days. If my lipomas get larger during that period, then I restart sulforaphane based on the assumption that it is effective for me.

Of course I would love to believe mine are going to disappear, but I think that is not to be. I think of what remains as scar tissue at this point.

Good Luck
matt1007
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by matt1007 » Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:21 pm

An update.

As I stated, I planned to stop sulforphane for 90 days and see what happened.

Well I did that, and to my surprise, nothing happened. If anything, my lipomas stayed exactly the same size or got slightly smaller.

Two possibilities, at least.

1. Sulforaphane was NOT the driver of my initial improvement in lipoma reduction.
2. The sulforaphane treatment was so effective it caused a permanent reduction.

And of course, a third possibility, something else I've done has caused the improvement.

As for the idea if there really is improvement, this is beyond question. Even my last doctor would have difficulty finding lipomas on my left side (they were always smaller on the left chest). The visible lipomas on the sides of my abdomen are almost impossible to see.

So, in conclusion, I have no conclusion. I fully expected to see my lipomas increase in size or number after I stopped the high dose sulforaphane and then I planned to resume the high dosage treatment (forever) as maintenance.

Now I have no additional ideas at this time.
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Re: Sulforaphane

Post by 251152 » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:33 am

thanks for the update man, maybe your lipomas just need longer time to start growing back? Usually they grow slowly so 90 days just may not be enough.

What about the appearance of new ones? What was the rate of them appearing before the treatment and what happened in these 90 days?
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